Right Place, Right Time

segolden · Right Place, Right Time

Fellow in town is selling this because his wife is moving on to something a little shorter in length, decided to take him up on it. It's a Fred Bear "Montana" American-style longbow in 45#, 64" long. Tried some of fred's arrows in it along with some alloys, works great, looks nice next to the ELB. Have to order a couple extra strings, but that's half the cost to me of the bow itself. Decided to name it "Mukwa", Ojibwa Indian for "black bear".

Steve B

Bro that is one time it is great to be in the right place, and right time. That little beauty looks so good , sure you don't want to sell her ?

Dawn

that looks very nice

Well done doing a deal like that

Liam

Looks a bueaty that does, im ever so slighlty jealous of you

segolden

Heh, don't think the guy's other half knows how little it's going for, or how much he's going to pay for the Black Widow he's getting for her. I ain't tellin', either, too dangerous.

jaselpool

Very nice indeed! Always fancied an AFB now I'm even more tempted!!

J

segolden

It certainly got my attention! The AFB seems to be growing in fashionable circles over here, as I noticed even metal-risered versions starting to pop up on the Web, and custom wood recurve makers are now building sets of interchangeable flatbow and recurve limbs for their risers. The market speaks.

After shooting "Mukwa" for a couple of days, I can see why people like the American style longbow. A bit less finicky about arrow spine than the ELB, a noticeable increase in arrow speed, and a little less "thump" in hand at the release, not that there's much of that with modern ELB's anyway. Apart from the above, there are several real advantages to this particular AFB over the traditional English bow that I can see: One, being shorter so maneuverability in the field is increased while decreasing the likelihood of damage; two, the materials used (this is a factory-made bow) are much tougher, allowing it to be left strung for long periods with fast-flight strings. Finally, a simple pair of string-silencers muffles what little noise it has at release, a distinct hunting advantage, without appreciable loss of arrow velocity.

Even at the retail prices of distributors, the Bear Montana is a bargain compared to similar hand-built models with the same performance at twice the cost. It may not be as fancy, but the target won't notice the difference.

Steve B

Never a truer word said Steve, wonderful to know you are enjoying "Mukwa"

segolden

Heh, now all I gotta do is explain how that second bow got in there with the first one. (

Uh oh, did I say that?

)

Steve B

Now you have a breeding pair , can I have first dibs on the pups

segolden

If I can talk this through, you'll have first dibs. Not sure if they're ready for marriage, however, couple things still up in the air. Will know by tonight, hopefully.

segolden

Still negotiating, but the price is looking better.

Samick Verna, 50# at 28", 64" long. Wicked shooter, has two deer to its credit. Needs a new shelf rug, a few field scratches but otherwise nice looking. My source ran off for Labor Day weekend, so I've got a few days to talk Kathy out of excessive use of the frying pan before I pay for it. Bribery may help...

Liam

Your closet may need extending soon to home all these bows

Nice looking bow and I here the samicks are generally good shooters

segolden

I'm like most men (boys never grow up, just ask our better halves), in that I tend to accumulate objects when deeply into something. You shoulda seen the place before we sold all the firearms! Now, at least, I don't have to worry about slipping on loose ammunition.

Was wondering about the Samick, though. Really skeptical at first, it being a sort of clone, but it seems to shoot just as fast and accurately as my Quinn recurve. Just hope I get to keep it.

segolden

Must be the holiday here (Labor Day, whatever that means these days), but things just don't work out sometimes. Weird, but I found out this morning that the fellow I was supposed to buy the bows from is actually in a divorce feud with his former "other half"; the ex came by and wanted the bows back, so I guess the deal's off. Oh well, back to square one. Darned good thing I hadn't paid for them yet.

segolden

I was looking at this fellow's work a while back, will be checking in with him now that the other bows fell through. I want to do more research before I put his address up here, but so far so good. Pretty stuff:

All his bows are bamboo-backed with osage cores, reflexed or deflex/reflexed, with various woods for the riser like kingwood, bocote, pao fero, bloodwood, etc. No glass, just natural materials, and of 58"-68" lengths. If his delivery time is as reasonable as his prices, this may be a better option (

he says with crossed fingers and toes).

Blackcat

Way nice bows Segolden. Let us know how it goes.

segolden

The gentlemen in question has a duplicate of the bow shown here, with rattlesnake-skin covering the bamboo backing. The riser is kingwood with bloodwood lams, and a core of osage. Will get the pictures tomorrow and make a decision go/no go at that time. Price is just unbelievably reasonable, and I've gotten very positive feedback from other sources. Will let you know what comes of it if the deal is sealed.

segolden

Well, so far so good; kinda hard to tell too much from the pics, but the little darlin's on its way here. This one's gonna be interesting, all 64" and 45#'s of her.

Steve B

That my friend, is one fine looking shooting machine you have purchased there

Enjoy her when you get her and shoot straight

Dawn

It does look very nice

Looking froward to seeing you shooting it

and hearing your views

segolden

Just in case people are interested, the bowyer is Leroy Buckley. He has an occasional offer on eBay, but he does special orders separately from there as well, and just recently shipped a bow to Italy. Contact him here:

tworiverslongbow@hotmail.com

"Buck" uses PayPal, and although he does this part-time in addition to his regular employment, he has a VERY quick turnaround time between order and shipment. If you want an AFB/longbow that is handmade of all-natural materials, and don't like the idea of waiting a year for the product, then he's your guy.

daohead

Seagolden,

That is a nice looking stick... too bad you couldn't join the Montana longbow club... but I think what you ended up with is pretty sweet... believe in destiny? karma?

segolden

At this point, I think it worked out for the best, won't know for sure until the bow arrives this week. If all goes well, I may use it for a puma hunt in October as the Phoenix has been held up in delivery. That may be destiny by someone's definition, but I prefer to think of it as a n-arrowing of choices.

Not that I have anything against factory-made bows; both the Montana and the Verna shoot very nicely, and have a slight advantage in that they're a bit more rugged because of the glass used. Just wish people would be more up-front about things, hate being blindsided.

Oh well. (BTW, this bowyer's from your neck of the woods, I think. Same state anyway.)

segolden

Goody goody, nice long package in the post today! Will break the darling in this week, then post an evaluation. Things are a bit hectic due to holidays around here, unfortunately. Onward and upward!

segolden

One thing I can say is that the quality certainly lives up to the pics. On the range, Fred's ELB is a stable gentleman of a longbow, whereas this Reflex/Deflex design just whips onto target and smacks an arrow into the butt with gusto, real point-and-shoot. Going to be interesting to see how it does at twenty/thirty yards, about max for this poundage.

Steve B

Look forwaqrd to hearing your reports Steve, nice sounding bow though love the point and shoot stuff, just so much fun

segolden

Talked Kathy into taking a couple of pics for me, hope it didn't break the camera. Range was 20 yards, taking my time, 375-gr. Gold Tip XT shafts with 100-gr. tips. The bow is smoothing out some as it is shot, got about a hundred arrows through it so far. Still a bit of stacking, but that's lessening over time, while the limbs have taken on 3/4" of string-follow, fairly typical of a pure-wood AFB. Seems to be happy with 6.5" brace height, with a small amount of twangy noise using light carbons (VERY quiet with heavier stuff). Nocking point is a quarter-inch above dead-level, and I'm beginning to think fast-flight strings may be a waste of money. Dacron may stretch, but it's SO much quieter without silencers that the performance difference is nil. I can see it if all you're looking for is speed, but if one is after game, a heavy arrow off Dacron is the way to go. Formal field shooting, where the Styrofoam doesn't jump the string, is another story IMHO.

(All comments about beer-guts and lard-butts cheerfully ignored.

)

Steve B

segolden

Knew I couldn't avoid the hat being called on.

Going to have to wash that thing after the heat's over, it's nearly green now instead of khaki. The snaps come in handy, though, keeps the brim out of the way of the string. Doesn't look as smart as the pith helmet, but more practical.

Steve B

Nice photos actually Steve, and I can't comment on anybodys "foward Balast" (beer guts

) as I have the same issue, middle age spread is really spreading

segolden

Sign of the times, I guess. Stupid thing is that I've lost a lot the last five years, problem is that what's left has shifted via gravity.

Back on subject (sorry, ADD is showing), will be trying carbon shafts with filler (table salt) this weekend to see how much penetration can be achieved. Will see how this works out for the recurve and both longbows. I'd prefer to use the GT XT's for hunting since they're more resilient than wood or alloy. At the ranges I can hit anything, trajectory isn't an issue.

Steve B

Looking forward to hearing the penetrations results with the filler. Are you having problems getting the GT XT's Steve ?

segolden

Uh, no problems getting the XT's, Steve, seems like they're the only shafts in stock here most of the time. Alloys are becoming hard to find outside the Internet or specific catalogs, however. There was a dry spell last year, when Gold Tip was bringing a new factory online, no problem now. Are these becoming scarce down there?

As for penetration results:

Bow: Quinn XL recurve, 43 lbs. at 27 inch draw, Bear Weatherest and SRS sight
Range: 20 yards
Target: dense polyfoam broadhead block
Shafts: Gold Tip XT Hunter carbon, Easton 1916 XX75 alloy
Heads: Outback Supreme 116-gr. two-blade (similar to Grizzly)

The XT's weighed 375 grains with three-feather parabolic fletching, snap-on nocks and broadhead, 460 grains with salt filler added. The 1916's ran 450 grains, 530-grs. with filler. Broadheads were resharpened after each shot.

The XT without filler penetrated an average of 3.75 inches over 5 shots into the foam; with filler, 5.15 inches.

The alloy 1916 without filler averaged 5.10 inches; with filler, 5.8 inches.

I also tried T-4 nocks with both XT's. The imparted spin did make a difference, increasing penetration of the carbon shafts an average of 1.0 inches for the unfilled shaft, 1.3 inches for the filled shaft. I've not tried this with the AFB, so am not certain if the same results noted above would be seen when shooting "off the shelf".

segolden

Addendum to last post:

The new AFB-style all-wood longbow performed well today, though a bit less penetration. Averaged 1/2 to 3/4" less than above listed totals for unfilled/filled carbon shafts. The T-4 nocks still added some depth, 3/4" more than snap-nocks. Remember, this foam is designed to stop broadhead shafts in very short order, so I expect the weighted shafts to perform well on game. A weighted GT XT arrow fully penetrated a straw bale and embedded itself in an old tire from 15 yards, so that I had to pull it out with pliers. Here, kitty kitty...

Steve B

Great report Steve, I find it great when you have areport on tis sort of thing from somebody you know. You know that the results they are printing are "spot on" rather than doctored.

As for the XT no worries down here either now, I like the arrowes from GT and they are the right price as well

segolden

Good! Heard a lot of discontent about GT's, though I haven't had any problems with them, but then I don't try to cut X's either.

All I had left to do was pick a name, and that was provided today. A common owl was hanging around last night, and I found it this morning where it had dropped dead and was hanging from our cattle fence, apparently electrocuted by a power line. I buried it off the road, but I like owls and other predator birds, so I looked up an Indian name in order to honor its spirit. "Nascha" is Navajo for owl, "Poloma" is Choctaw for bow. I ran them together, "Naschapoloma", which seems to have a certain ring to it, I think. "Owlbow" it shall be, then. Rest in peace, carrier of names, and may your claws take much game through our arrows.

Steve B

Like the name you have chosen for your bow and I am sure the "Sprit of the owl" thanks you for your kindess.

Well done Steve all round you have done very well