Shorter Draw length benifits?

Author

Message

Liam
Admin

UK East Mids Area Rep (NFAS)

Posts: 6536
Archery Website Publisher
Location: AR HQ

Posted: Tue Dec 11, 2007 10:06 pm Post subject: Shorter Draw length benifits?

I'm currently at 30 1/4" draw length and changing bow very soon, Ratfighter mantioned shortening my draw length today, I have thought about this before, maybe by 1/2 inch to an inch, question is what are the benifits of doing this? I have a couple of days consider this as Stu369 will be building an XV for me to test out next monday, so I'd like to let him know sooner than later _________________ Why not?

Club: Long Eaton Field Archers
Bow: Karel Osage Orange Hungarian Reflex Bow 50lb @ 28"
Sight: Not Brilliant
Arrows: Sitka Spruce 11/32's @ 31"
Accesories: 2 Funny gloves with not enough fingers on them

Steve B
Admin

The Original Archers Rest Webmaster & Co-Admin
Australasia Area Rep (ABA - IFAA)
Posts: 4089
No Commercial Interest
Location: Victoria, Australia

Posted: Tue Dec 11, 2007 10:52 pm Post subject:

To me, Draw length is either right or wrong. If you have been comfortable with the length you have, and have been able to work your scapular to make the shot go off then all is well. To me your draw length is determinded by the position of the scapular. ie: your elbow and release arm needs to be in line with the arrow so the lines of force are through the elbow , arrow and where your hand contacts the bow, this will ensure good lines for when the arrow is released by moving the scapular (release side only)to actuate the shot. A good book on this is by Larry Wise called Core Archery. So I guess you need to answer your own question are you over drawing now or is the positioning right of everything Liam? I am sure that Ratty 501 will be pleased to help you out to determine this

Club: Phoenix Field Archers of Sale. Victoria , Australia
Bow: Bowtech Commander
Sight: Copper John Ants
Arrows: Gold Tip Pro's
Accesories: Carter Just-B-Cuz

Steve B
Admin

The Original Archers Rest Webmaster & Co-Admin
Australasia Area Rep (ABA - IFAA)
Posts: 4089
No Commercial Interest
Location: Victoria, Australia

Posted: Tue Dec 11, 2007 10:58 pm Post subject:

Just as an aside for others that may look at this in the classroom there is an article about draw length you can find it HERE. Might be worth reading again Liam, I find I need to revisit the articles I have in my Knowledge base sometimes

Club: Phoenix Field Archers of Sale. Victoria , Australia
Bow: Bowtech Commander
Sight: Copper John Ants
Arrows: Gold Tip Pro's
Accesories: Carter Just-B-Cuz

Ratfighter
Global Moderator

Posts: 733
Staff Shooter
Location: the Ratcave

Posted: Sat Dec 15, 2007 10:50 am Post subject:

Didn't spot this post until today. I made the comment as you appeared slightly overstretched. Ideally (well according to John Dudley anyway) you should not draw much past the corner of your mouth. According to Bernie Pellerite the majority of archers have a draw length that is too long. You just looked over extended on the bow arm and the draw hand. In the past I made the mistake of drawing too long to try and gain extra speed, it doesn't work!. You are lucky with your build, you don't need to steal that extra 1/2" So what does it do. Firstly, drawing too far back means you are already compressing your deltoid. You have a limited amount of compression in the muscle (or is that contraction?). Utilising some or all of the contraction to draw, leaves less to execute the shot correctly. This means you have to use something else to make the shot go. So triggering can or has to occur. You can't consistently trigger (unless your name is Una-Vita). Secondly. the natural and most consistent way of shooting is to use you skeletal form . your bow hand wrist, sets back naturally into the the joint, the forearm sets back naturally into the elbow joint, this then sets back into the shoulder. This is consistent and repeatable. If you have to start pushing, you start using muscles instead of bone. Then can you push consistently? what happens when you tire?. So you lose form. Thirdly, wehen you draw you are loading across your body, when you loose, that loading has to go somewhere. Your body expands. If you are drawn to your correct length, by using a correct stance that load should go forward. If you are over stretched you open out, your bow will fly to one side. Ther problem is, whilst you are doing this, 30" of arrow is trying to navigate around your riser. Archery is about repeating a process, nothing more. To achieve this you have to work with your body, if you can physically draw 28" you have to accept this. It is certainly no use insisting on drawing 30". Secondly, if you can physically draw 56lb, there is no point insisting on drawing 65lb. as the americans say, "your mouth is writing cheques your body can't cash" These are the most misundertood or disregarded facts in archery and the biggest reason for poor form. Now I'm not saying you have any or all these traits but whilst I was writing a Ratty 101, I thought it might help others. So finally how do you tell. The easiest way is to be honest with yourself. Get someone to photograph you and study the form. The bow shoulder rotates the further you stretch, it looks like it is bunching. The bow elbow rotates too and often the wrist is used to push into the grip. The wrist rotates from the inside. You can move your wrist a good 1" at the thumb end, whereas the inside wrist postion barely moves. the consistent grip therefore is found at that point. measurement shold be taken with a low bow shoulder and using the inside wrist point as the grip point, if that makes sense! As far as the draw arm there should be capacity to fully utilise the deltoid. The best way to check this is to close your eyes and concetrate on nothing but the squeeze. The net result of correct draw length and poundage should be a good executable shot and a bow that moves straight forward towards the target. Then it is all down to practise and good technique! There are a number of writers out there, and good shot execution is an often covered topic. Personally I would seek out books by Bernie Pellerite. He has worked with many of the top coaches, and makes no secret of the fact that a number of his techniques are merely an amalgamation of appled thinking. What he does is put it in terms that are entertaining, understandable and with pictures. Unfortunately they also come with his jokes and a high cover price! _________________ MERLIN ARCHERY CLUB GETTING RATTIER BY THE MINUTE

Club: Merlin Archery Club
Bow: Merlin XS x2
Sight: Axcel 3000 Viper Scope
Arrows: Navigators & Gold Tip Ultralight Pro's
Accesories: Apollo launcher, CC Porter release, Merlin Triad stabiliser

Bows now sporting my own strings!!!! yummy!!

Liam
Admin

UK East Mids Area Rep (NFAS)

Posts: 6536
Archery Website Publisher
Location: AR HQ

Posted: Sat Dec 15, 2007 1:11 pm Post subject:

A lot of what Ratfighter says rings true for me and makes sense, I'll try the bow as it is and get some opinions on my draw length whilst at Merlin, I'm sure they drop the draw length if required whilst we test the bow _________________ Why not?

segolden
Moderator

Posts: 2410
No Commercial Interest
Location: Willcox, Arizona, USA

Posted: Sat Dec 15, 2007 2:08 pm Post subject:

All I can tell you is what happened as long as my draw was too long (never did get the blasted bow fully corrected before I sold it): Developed a heck of a flinch at release, never knew when a flyer would show up, even missed the bag entirely on occasion. Talk about target panic! Funny how all that doesn't appear when I shoot my conventional bows, LOL. _________________ "For I have drawn Judah taut and applied [My hand] to Ephraim as to a bow." Zech. 9:13 http://www.freenations.freeuk.com/ http://www.melaniephillips.com/

Club: none
Bow: Quinn Comet XL, Grozer Horsebow, KG ELB, Two Rivers R/D
Sight: DAS Kinetic SRF
Arrows: Easton X7 Eclipse 1916's, GT XT Hunter 3555's
Accesories: Sims SRS stab, enhancer & Limbsavers; Dawgware side-quiver

Awaiting MBLLC Phoenix bow

Liam
Admin

UK East Mids Area Rep (NFAS)

Posts: 6536
Archery Website Publisher
Location: AR HQ

Posted: Sat Dec 15, 2007 2:14 pm Post subject:

I can relate to that too Steve, draw length has got to come down me thinks _________________ Why not?

segolden
Moderator

Posts: 2410
No Commercial Interest
Location: Willcox, Arizona, USA

Posted: Sat Dec 15, 2007 2:24 pm Post subject:

Ah, to have an actual shop within reasonable driving range, sigh. _________________ "For I have drawn Judah taut and applied [My hand] to Ephraim as to a bow." Zech. 9:13 http://www.freenations.freeuk.com/ http://www.melaniephillips.com/